The Royal Podcast of Oz: It's For Kids — An Interview With Robert Payes

In this episode, Jared talks to Robert Payes, the son of Rachel Cosgrove Payes, author of The Hidden Valley of Oz and The Wicked Witch of Oz. Discover the environment this Royal Historian raised her children in, and discover what she may have meant by saying "Oz is for kids."

As always, you can listen and download at the podcast site, or use the player below.

       

   
   
Podcast Powered By Podbean
   

Rachel Cosgrove Payes in "Oz: The American Fairyland"

In June, 2008, I got a message from a YouTube user. They've since closed their account, so there's no point in saying their screen name, the only name I knew. By this time, my Wonders of Oz and other Oz videos had kind of made me a go-to-Oz guy on YouTube. I've more or less relaxed since.

Anyway, this is what they said:

A cousin and I have been researching or family tree and we just found out that we are related to Rachel C. Payes. I thought let me give it a shot and type the name in youtube...this is great...do you have any other info on her?
Also do you know where I can find the film OZ: The American Fairyland? 

 Unfortunately, I didn't know more about Rachel Cosgrove Payes at the time. I do now, however. And I didn't own Oz: The American Fairyland, either. However, I looked for the videotape and eventually purchased it.

Oz: The American Fairyland was an excellent (if a little dull) documentary about the origins of Oz and a look at the phenomenon as a whole. There was an odd focus on Oz dolls in the second half, and I've spotted one factual inaccuracy.

Since it was 2008 and VHS was getting harder to use, I needed to convert it to a digital version quickly. Fortunately, I had a couple other Oz transfers I needed to do so I already had most of the stuff I needed. I needed to upgrade my system, which I did in early 2009, and finally got a transfer finished.

The user contacted me again and I said I could try to get a DVD to them, but they never contacted me with their address.

Well, instead of putting it on a regular DVD myself, I burned the video file to a DVD-R as a data disc with some other things and then put it away.

However, as my family will tell you, I have THOUSANDS of DVD-Rs of data on them. And I'm VERY bad at labeling. (In fact, my brother says that is "extraordinarily true.") So, when I was re-reading Rachel Cosgrove Payes' Oz stuff for my FF+ blogs, I did want to see her interview again, but I couldn't find my video transfer. I had the VHS, but I'd upgraded my computer again and my old transfer hardware was incompatible.

Finally I managed to recover the file earlier this week and watched it again. I don't know if that person who'd contacted me is still looking for this, even if they were for real. I edited the clips of Rachel into a single video, though cutting it with VirtualDub was a little rough.



The factual inaccuracy was in that clip. John R. Neill's last Oz book was Lucky Bucky in Oz, not The Scalawagons of Oz.

Rachel Cosgrove Payes' Oz-Stories

Apparently, Rachel Cosgrove Payes became good friends with Eric Shanower and David Maxine, thanks to Eric's work on The Wicked Witch of Oz. When Maxine began Hungry Tiger Press, one of their first offerings was Oz-Story Magazine. The annual anthology would consist of new and old Oz and Oz-related work.

Their first issue, appearing in 1994, contained "Percy and the Shrinking Violets" by Rachel Cosgrove Payes. I can't claim to know exactly how it was written, I can only imagine that they asked if she would be interested in writing a story for it, and this was the end result.

"Percy and the Shrinking Violets" opens in Lake Lavendra, a little kingdom in the Gillikin Country, where the ruler Violetta is discontent at ruling such a tiny part of Oz, so she enacts a plan to take over all of Oz from Ozma.

Percy finds a strange boy in the palace gardens, who has a gift of violets for Ozma. Percy, despite the boy's protestations, takes the boy's violets to Ozma's apartments himself.  The worried boy is then nowhere to be seen. Ozma is not in her apartments at the moment, so Jellia puts them in her room.

Percy and Jellia then notice that they are growing smaller, while they attempt to find out what became of the boy. They ask the Magic Picture to see Violetta, since the boy mentioned her, and they see her scolding the boy and he removes a pin he was wearing. Ozma soon returns and sends Percy to Glinda's palace with the Magic Belt to see if he can find out what happened. It tells him that Violetta sent Ozma a shrinking violet.

Percy is then sent to Lake Lavendra to investigate further, and he finds the boy, who introduces himself as Bloo, Crim's son. (YES! Back to the creative names!) Violetta used her Shrinking Violets to take over Lake Lavendra, making everyone shrink with the scent of the violets, and giving them pins to counteract the violets only if they agreed to obey her. Since Bloo doesn't have his pin, he decides to risk it and help Percy steal enough pins from Violetta's Palace for themselves and Jellia and Ozma. They manage to, even though they are discovered by Violetta and chased by her and a cook with a cleaver. Ozma brings them to the Emerald City, just in time.

With Ozma, Jellia, Bloo, and Percy regaining their proper sizes (or in Percy's case, his giant size), Ozma sends all the Shrinking Violets to the Deadly Desert with the Magic Belt, meaning that no one has to fear the violets anymore. Then, Violetta is brought before Ozma. With her magic and violets removed from her, Violetta is encouraged to be a more caring and gentle ruler, and agrees to do so.

Even in short form, Rachel Cosgrove Payes continued to write good Oz stories. This one, in only 13 pages, sets up a threat to Ozma's rule, a magical attack on her, and the way it was thwarted, all with great characters old and new. Quite an adventure for a short story, and Rachel did it well.

A couple years later, Oz-Story Magazine featured a new story by her, entitled "Spots in Oz." This story brought a somewhat different approach to Oz.

Two freckle-faced Winkie twin children called Fudge and Taffy are having a birthday. A nearby herb lady gives them presents. Fudge gets a chemistry set, while Taffy gets a doll dress kit. Fudge sets to making some spot remover for his mother, while Taffy is jealous of her brother's gift. Fudge needs some soapwort for his spot remover, but he won't let Taffy help him find some. Taffy, indignant, goes to find some witchwort to ruin the compound.

The Leopard with the Changing Spots, and the Hungry Tiger happen to be in this part of Oz, and happen to see Taffy picking  witchwort. They accidentally scare her and she runs home, telling her mother what happened. Fudge is working on his spot remover, and Taffy slips in the witchwort.

However, the effect of the witchwort makes spots disappear to an extreme extent! The spots from dresses and curtains vanish, the Leopard's spots disappear, and even the twins' freckles are gone! Spots and the Hungry Tiger arrive at the twins' home, intending to apologize for frightening Taffy, though now they are wondering what became of Spots' spots! They make their apologies, and Taffy and Fudge's mother and the two beasts are curious as to what could have happened.

Finally, the two twins are sent to the herb lady, who, from Taffy's looks, deciphers what happened. She sends Fudge to get some soapwort, while Taffy admits her crime. Fortunately, the herb lady knows what to do, and with Fudge's help, a new compound is made that reverses the damage done. Taffy confesses her guilt, but all is forgiven, and the Hungry Tiger and Spots are welcome guests at the twins' birthday dinner.

While not quite as exciting as her previous work, "Spots in Oz" is a fine tale, especially for getting in Taffy's mind and helping us really sympathize with the girl when she fears the Tiger or Spots may eat her, or that she may receive a severe punishment from her mother. It's also great to have Spots as a lead character, given his appearance in Hidden Valley was so brief. (Though, it must be admitted, this isn't really any more substantial.)

What I really wonder about the story is where is Taffy and Fudge's father?

This was the final Oz story written by Rachel Cosgrove Payes, as she died in 1998. She did intend to write another short story for Oz-Story Magazine, but it didn't happen. However, David Maxine had discussed with her publishing the original first chapter of The Hidden Valley of Oz, and she was apparently open to it and provided him with it, as it appeared in the final issue.

Cosgrove's Oz is very close to Baum's Oz. She felt that Oz was for children, and didn't believe there were deeper meanings to the Oz stories. As such, one of the few things her Oz lacks is any witty commentary or puns or jokes. She also wasn't big on bringing technology to Oz, though the appearance of Leon the Neon indicates that she wasn't opposed to it.

All the same, Cosgrove's simple take on Oz is effective and welcome, after the odd stories of Thompson, the silliness of Neill's, and the overabundance of Baum references in Snow. Her contribution to the legacy of Oz stands as an enjoyable collection of work. (Admittedly, I couldn't wait to cover it.)

The Wicked Witch of Oz

Rachel Cosgrove Payes refused to let anyone so much as look at her manuscript for The Wicked Witch of Oz until it was a book. Well, the International Wizard of Oz Club finally offered to publish it in 1993, just as they had published two books by Thompson and another Oz book by the next Royal Historian. This time, however, they released it in a different form. Those books were oversized paperbacks (there was a limited run of hardcovers, too), with limited illustrations by Dick Martin, who had passed away in 1990.

However, Oz fans didn't like the paperbacks. Those with collections of older Oz books (or, at 1993, those collecting the ongoing reprints by Books of Wonder) would have to resort to a different format.

Not so with Wicked Witch. It was printed in hardcover, with proper typefaces and page layouts to create an attractive book. It was also just as tall as the original Oz books, though it wasn't as wide. (Page margins had shrunk in the last forty years.) Also on board was Eric Shanower, willing to lend his illustration services not just to the Club, but also to Rachel as her second Oz book finally saw print. I'll get to the illustrations later, but they were definitely a big change from Dick Martin's work.

Singra, the Wicked Witch of the South, awakens from a hundred year sleep that Glinda put her under. Cosgrove then describes the morning of a Wicked Witch, and while Singra doesn't do anything particularly evil, it's clear by her living habits that she isn't the nicest witch. She decides to find out from her Musical Magical Snuff Box how her cousins, the Wicked Witches of the East and West are. Boy, is she in for a surprise when she is informed that Dorothy did away with them! She will have to work out some plan to deal with Dorothy...

And in case you're thinking Glinda will read of this in the Book of Records, she won't. She's just left on a vacation to Ix that Ozma insisted she take. The Scarecrow will be going to Glinda's to keep an eye on the Book, but he doesn't leave until after Singra has begun her plans. Which is too bad, because she's determined to turn Dorothy into a piece of cheese, and she needs two things to complete it: some red powder that only Glinda has, and straw from a live man's body. And there's only one live man in Oz who has straw in his body.

The Scarecrow reads in the Book of Records that Singra stole the powder and goes to investigate the magic room, but is caught by Singra, who steals some of his straw, then ties him up and exits, cheerfully informing Glinda's servants that the Scarecrow doesn't want to be disturbed. She hurries back to her hut and completes her potion, which she then takes to the Emerald City. Upon reaching the Palace, she is met by Percy, the Personality Kid, or rather, the giant rat from Hidden Valley. He tells her that Dorothy is around the corner in the gardens, so Singra follows his directions, and finds a girl there and gives her the potion, telling her it is Ozade. Dorothy is horrified to see Trot turn into a piece of green cheese! Realizing her mistake, Singra takes the cheese with her anyway.

Dorothy and Percy are on the chase, but cannot overtake Singra, given they have only the scent of the cheese to go by. And even worse, in classic Oz book style, strange people delay them. There's a rubber band, a group of men made of rubber who play music.

Dorothy and Percy make a new friend and companion in Leon the Neon, a man who was experimenting with neon tubing when he had an accident and became a human neon sign. This is Cosgrove's first real "grotesque" character, and one of the few in the Oz series. Baum created several, but Thompson only had Handy Mandy (Grampa and Kuma Party are close seconds, though). and Neill didn't have any.

When Dorothy and Percy stop to get some honey, bees capture the trio and force them to slave away for them. They are sealed away in beeswax cells, but Percy manages to use his teeth to get them out, and they make a good escape. But their troubles are far from over. Next they encounter hummingbirds that offer them nectar to drink, but it gives Percy and Dorothy wings, making them fly high in the air. The wings vanish after a time, because one must continue drinking nectar to maintain them, and Dorothy and Percy can't. However, they did see a hut where they decide they can go to ask for directions.

The hut turns out to be Singra's, and she has woven a net to cast on Dorothy to turn her to stone. And, as fate would have it, Dorothy was the one who went to the door. Percy and Leon are by Singra's ink well, when Percy smells cheese, so they pull up the bucket and find Trot in her enchanted form. Fortunately, Percy knows not to eat it. Leon goes to ask Singra the way to the Emerald City to see if Dorothy is all right, but sees the statue. Singra gives him a ransom letter to take to Ozma.

Betsy Bobbin has grown concerned over not seeing Dorothy or Trot for a couple of days. Ozma thinks they may be visiting the Scarecrow or the Tin Woodman, but when the Tin Woodman arrives without having seen either, Ozma checks the Magic Picture and sees Percy and Leon carrying a piece of cheese, running back to the Emerald City, the Scarecrow, tied up in Glinda's workshop, and Dorothy turned into a stone statue in Singra's hut. Dorothy is brought to the Emerald City by Magic Belt, and the Wizard can't find a way to restore her, so he goes to Glinda's with Betsy, Ozma, and the Tin Woodman, where they rescue the Scarecrow and read about Singra in the Book of Records. Along the way back to the Emerald City, they overtake Percy and Leon. Ozma reads the letter, seeing that it demands that Dorothy and Trot will remain transformed if they do not make her the Witch of the South, taking over from Glinda.

While everyone is away at Glinda's, Jellia cleans the room Dorothy is in, sadly noting the fate of this beloved girl. She notices Singra's net, which looks like a spider web. She attempts to dust it off, but that doesn't work, so she tries removing it, and it comes off easily, restoring Dorothy.

The Magic Belt is used to bring Singra to the Emerald City before Ozma, and she is forced to restore Trot. Ozma then has her drink the Water of Oblivion (it was revealed earlier that she un-courteously saved the life of a water nymph, who made her "impervious" to water, but apparently, it has a normal effect if it is drunk), then she is sent to sleep, having forgotten all her magic and wickedness, for another hundred years.

Many fans consider Wicked Witch better than Hidden Valley, and I must agree. There is a tighter plot that is much more exciting, even if we do have some little stops along the way. Rachel Cosgrove Payes uses the classic Oz characters in ways that are true to their characters, and Percy, still as headstrong and wisecracking as ever, really comes into his own here. (It seems at one point, the book was called Percy in Oz.)

But the real star is the Wicked Witch herself, Singra! She is a true, out and out villain, but yet, you enjoy reading about her. You don't want her to win, of course, but her side of the story is so deliciously wicked, it's fun to read, and you're a little sorry that it's over when you reach the end.

Now, I can't help but mention Eric Shanower's illustrations. Unlike many previous Oz books, The Wicked Witch of Oz is lavishly illustrated. Any two-page spread has an illustration. This definitely makes the book more attractive than Hidden Valley. And, unlike some illustrators who simplify their designs for book-length illustration jobs, Shanower illustrates in his regular style consistently.

So, if anyone had doubted Rachel Cosgrove Payes' claim to be a Royal Historian with Hidden Valley, she more than made up for it with Wicked Witch. If only Reilly & Lee hadn't turned this one down, who knows if the Oz series may have actually picked up again?

And we're not done with her yet!

The Hidden Valley of Oz

The dedicated Oz fans were out there, and when they didn't have new Oz books, or ones they wanted to read, they wrote their own. Fans would write their stories for themselves and sometimes their friends and family. Goodness knows how many Oz stories have actually been written and left unpublished. But one first time writer, Rachel Cosgrove, wrote her own for herself and her mother, and on a whim, sent it to Reilly & Lee.

To Cosgrove's surprise, she received a letter from an editor saying she had read it to her "critical" eight year old, who had loved it. The editor suggested some revisions, and that if she wasn't contacted again in a year, she should re-submit her story. Frank O'Donnell offered to buy the story, and Rocket Trip to Oz was underway. Cosgrove was thrilled!

At some point, they asked her to remove the rocket ship. Cosgrove recalled that they had rejected a rocket ship story, but there was also the fact that Speedy arrived in Oz in a rocket ship in The Yellow Knight of Oz. Revisions were done, and in 1951, the thirty-ninth Oz book, The Hidden Valley of Oz, was released.

The original first chapter with the rocket ship was printed in Oz-Story Magazine #6 (we'll get to why it was there in a few blogs) and involves a little boy named Jonathan Andrew Manley (or Jam, from his initials) sneaking aboard his father's test rocket ship which is launched.

I'm not entirely sure why, but I prefer Cosgrove's revised version in which Jam builds a collapsible kite that can be folded up when not in use. It winds up being much more powerful than he thought, and he ties a crate that he can sit in to the kite. He also brings along a white rat and two guinea pigs. But, as you can guess, the kite carries them far away to Oz, specifically a Hidden Valley in the Gillkin Country.

The Hidden Valley is held in the thrall of a giant named Terp the Terrible, having the people make grape jam (it is the purple Gillikin Country after all) for his muffins from his magic muffin tree, which is guarded by a fabulous 2-headed beast. They advise him, and the guinea pigs and rat (who can now talk and call themselves Pinny, Gig, and Percy, respectively), to get out of the Valley before Terp catches them. ... Which is what happens almost immediately afterward. And Jam makes the big mistake of introducing himself as "Jam," making Terp decide to eat him for breakfast on a muffin.

It is the resourceful and street smart Percy who saves Jam by bringing a vine to the window of his prison room, allowing him to make an escape by night with Pinny and Gig. However, Percy is wondering why Terp is so protective of the Magic Muffins and runs back to steal one. By the time he catches up with Jam and the Guinea Pigs, they have been captured by Equinots, who are basically centaurs who wear clothes. Going on a hunch, Percy eats some of the magic muffin and grows to Jam's size, scaring away the Equinots.

Jam and Percy decide they will go west and attempt to find the woodman the people in the Hidden Valley wanted to come to help cut down the Magic Muffin tree. Before long, they come across a farmhouse where they are allowed to stay the night. Pinny and Gig decide to stay with the farmer's children, thus letting them drop out of the plot.

Next up is Kite Island, where the Wicked Witch of the West brought kites she had taken away from happy children. They discover the Collapsible Kite, which has been in Jam's pocket the whole time, is alive but just lacked a face to communicate with them. The Kites are grateful after Jam unties them and help them back over the river they had to cross, which got them stranded on Kite Island.

They soon arrive at the Tin Woodman's Castle, where, after being made guests, Percy begins shrinking and must have more of the magic muffin to remain at his large size. The Tin Woodman suggests that they go to the Emerald City. Percy hopes Ozma can help him stay at his large size. The next morning, Dorothy and the Scarecrow arrive, and they decide to go to the Hidden Valley to help the people get rid of Terp. Dorothy and the Scarecrow arrived on the Cowardly Lion and Hungry Tiger.

They soon meet a new big cat friend: the Spots, the Leopard with the Changing Spots. As his full name suggests, he can change his spots to look like hearts, diamonds, pinwheels, etc. None of the other animals trust him, so he's an outcast. But Dorothy and her friends don't have a history of being particular and welcome him along. However, he's not in the plot long as their next stop, Bookville, has the party captured and almost put into books, but Percy manages to gnaw a way out for them, thanks to the help of a Rhyming Dictionary, who Spots takes to the Emerald City.

Next little stop along the way is Ice Town, where Snowmen also throw them in prison, which happens to be an igloo. The Scarecrow sacrifices his straw to build a fire to melt it so they can escape. Luckily, they shortly meet a Winkie farmer who happily lets them have straw to re-stuff him.

The Tin Woodman makes a raft from some trees to carry them across a wide river, but the wood rebels at having been cut down and carries them in the wrong direction. The Scarecrow gets an idea and convinces it that that's the direction they WANT to go in, so it rebels again, and carries them to where they really want to go.

The Lion and Tiger and Tin Woodman's axe allows them to cross the Equinot's territory without interference. In the Hidden Valley, the Scarecrow comes up with a plan. At night, the Tin Woodman manages to hypnotize the guardian of the Magic Muffin tree into a well-mannered beast by swinging his axe (how that works, don't ask), which he then uses to chop down the tree. The next morning, Terp is told that Jam is back in the valley, and is tricked into looking for him in a smokestack in the jam factory. This incapacitates him, and with no Magic Muffins, he begins to shrink into a normal Gillikin.

Then a return to the Emerald City, where Percy is allowed to stay, and also is made to stay as large as he presently is. Jam is returned home in a crate tied to the Collapsible Kite, by means of a wishing pill.

The Hidden Valley of Oz is a good Oz story, although, in writing this blog, I had to have the book open to remember everything. It's not quite as memorable as (guess what?) Cosgrove's later Oz stories, which most fans agree are better. Still, I like that Cosgrove doesn't rely heavily on magic, and when it is brought in, she manages to use it as a proper plot device. The Oz characters use their wits and abilities to solve their problems, even the big problem of Terp. So, even though this wasn't one of the best Oz stories, it was far from a bad one.

The worst thing about Hidden Valley is the illustrations. Neill's delicate and elegant poster-style art was not emulated, and whatever bizarre charm was behind Kramer's uneven work was also missing. The pictures are flat and reminded me of illustrations you would see in novels based on live action TV shows and films in the 1950s. (My dad had a few.) That they would turn to artwork like this shows how little Reilly & Lee were investing in this relaunch of Oz: not much at all.

When the International Wizard of Oz Club reprinted the book in the early 1990s, Eric Shanower offered to re-illustrate the book. They rejected the offer. I can only assume it was to create a historical presentation. I suppose Shanower still could, but he's a very busy writer and cartoonist, and someone would have to handle the rights situation, since the book is still under copyright. It would have been nice, because Cosgrove's later Oz work was illustrated by Shanower.

Anyway, speaking of that later Oz work, Cosgrove turned out another book called The Wicked Witch of Oz, but Reilly & Lee were not interested, since sales on Hidden Valley were not impressive. The International Wizard of Oz Club offered to serialize it in The Baum Bugle, but Cosgrove insisted that if this was to be seen at all, it needed to be in book form.

Cosgrove's breakout with Oz led to many other books. These were mainly romance and science fiction novels, published from the 1960s to the 80s. Some were under pen names, like E. L. Arch, or Joanne Kaye. No one would expect an Oz author to be turning out books called Satan's Mistress or The Coach to Hell!

However, about 1993, Cosgrove—or rather, Payes—and the International Wizard of Oz Club managed to make a deal, but we'll get to that next time.

Recently Read Oz Books

Well, here's a listing of some Oz books I've read recently. I cut them short because some of them I haven't read for awhile, and also, I'm planning to do indepth blogs on all of the Famous Forty and the other Oz books by their authors. Three of these books fall in that category.

The Ork in Oz by Jack and Larry Brenton When Blinkie the Witch gets hold of the Giant with the Hammer and joins forces with Mombi and the Wisp (with a horde of wasps at his command), they quickly come up with a plan to conquer Oz for themselves. It's up to Orville the Ork and a boy from Ivalor named Irving to save Oz. Overall, a good story, but the whole "Baddies conquer Oz" plot is very old.

Yankee in Oz by Ruth Plumly Thompson Tompy and Yankee the space dog arrive in Oz after a hurricane. Soon, they find themselves looking for the lost Princess Doffi of Wackajammy. However, when her captor, the giant Badmannah, decides to find a replacement, he turns his eyes to Princess Ozma! Another good story, but it felt very brief. One can tell that even 32 years after "Ozoplaning With The Wizard of Oz," Thompson was still struggling for ideas for a good Oz story.

Toto of Oz by Gina Wickwar Probably one of the better written Oz books in the lot. When the bride of the King of Kiltoon mysteriously vanishes, poet Sonny looks for something to cheer the King up, and thinks of Toto. A little boy named Davy and his new pony Lollipop wind up in Oz, with a mysterious tartan saddle blanket. And Toto himself goes off looking for his growl, which is missing again. How are all three of these plots connected? I was glad to see the three stories become one, and it is definitely one of the most beautifully and lavishly illustrated Oz books I've seen in a long time.

The Royal Book of Oz by Ruth Plumly Thompson (I don't care what the cover said!) This was actually a re-read. When the Woggle-Bug points out that the Scarecrow has no family tree, he goes to look for the closest thing he has to one: the pole Dorothy found him on back in "The Wonderful Wizard of Oz." He soon discovers the Silver Islands, where he is hailed as the reincarnation of their Emperor. Dorothy and the Cowardly Lion head out to look for their old friend, and wind up meeting Sir Hokus of Pokes, the Yellow Knight of Oz. This story just never sat completely well with me, but it's filled with the whimsy that was Thompson's trademark. It was a nice bridging point between Baum and Thompson, however.

The Wicked Witch of Oz by Rachel Cosgrove Payes Singra, the Wicked Witch of the South, awakes from a century-long sleep Glinda placed her under. Hearing the fates of the Wicked Witches of the East and West, she decides to take preventive measures: turning Dorothy into a piece of cheese! But when she transforms Trot instead, Dorothy, Percy the Personality Kid, and new friend Leon the Neon are off to her rescue! Cosgrove writes the story in a suitably whimsical yet logical fashion, which feels right for Oz. The book is also excellently illustrated by Eric Shanower.